Teach Soap

My surfactants and other stuff arrived, so now starts the hard work.
I'm working with cocoamide propyl betaine, sodium cocoamphoacetate, and Dehyton AB-30 which is described as a derivative of fatty acid amines with a betaine structure. The one I like best is the cocoamphoacetate. It's quite thick and has a lovely deep rose colour.

Sounds like a recipe for bath gel or body wash.

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Irena
Closed minds are like faulty parachutes; they refuse to open.

Yep!
Having discovered that all three of my surfactants are amphoteric, I now have the rep arriving tomorrow with 20Kg of anionic surfactant! Can't use the salt curve to thicken amphoterics - duh!

Experiment 1:

ALS . . . . . 40g (23%)
Dehyton KB . . . . . 30g (17.5%)
Dehyton G . . . . . 10g (6%)
glycerin . . . . . 6g (4%)
aloe vera xtrct x10 conc . . . . . 2g (1.2% actual, = to 12% conc.)
d-limonene . . . . . 2g (1.2%)
avocado oil . . . . . 2g (1.2%)
water . . . . . 80g (46.5%)
total mass = 172g

ALS = ammonium lauryl sulphate (anionic)
KB = coco betaine (amphoteric)
G = sodium cocoamphoacetate (amphoteric)

charged 500mL beaker in order of list, microwaved on low to 35C, blended.
mixture immediately thickened to GOK how many whatevers that's measured in, like really really thick hair gel.
assumption: the salt content in the amphoterics put the anionic right in the middle of the salt curve.

Added 60 mL water, reblended. Still very thick. Filled it into 250mL pump bottle and tried it as a shampoo and shower item.

Verdict: It was a definite improvement on the reference bottle of Caprice, but nowhere near as good as the Vicky's Secret B&S Cream. (!)
Left the hair (what's left that is) with more volume, easier to manage, better shine, good slip. Not dull or rough. No discernible eye or scalp irritation. Faint aroma of citrus from the d-limonene, just about the right amount I think. I'll add a touch of citronellol the next batch.
The shampoo was ridiculously strong. Three pumps from the bottle produced a huge amount of foam.
Later on I found that the shampoo had become even thicker in the bottle so now it won't even move if you turn the bottle upside down.

I'm not familar with your surfactants, but here is what I have done as a starting point:

surfactant: 30-50%
distilled water: 47-67%
citric acid = 1%
dimethicone: 1-2%
liquid germall+: 0.5%

panthenol, hydrolized wheat or soy protein: 1-3%
EO or FO: anywhere between 1% to 2% depending on safety & strength.

You can find lots of formulas here> http://www.theherbarie.com/The-Formulary-p-7.html

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Irena
Closed minds are like faulty parachutes; they refuse to open.

As you can see, I used 46% surfactant then had to dilute it and even then it set solid! I think a more appropriate amount is going to be about 10% of surfactant. I still have to add the MEA, which thickens, and the pearliser, which also thickens ... and the vitamin E and shea butter! I'll get there bit by bit. I'm aiming at a particular product range
Oh I forgot to mention one thing I had in it: I put in 0.2% quaternium-60. It outperforms the cyclopentasiloxane or dimethicone I have on the shelf, in hair products, but it's a tiny amount, hard to measure.

Made a full-on try at duplicating my target product. Too much surfactant and too much lipids. It worked well as a 2-in-1 product, a conditioning shampoo. I will adjust the percentages and try again. Meanwhile I will keep the 2-in-1 formula handy, with a bit of adjustment it will be fine I think.

So is the formula too thin?

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Irena
Closed minds are like faulty parachutes; they refuse to open.

Have you tried using liquid Crothix to thicken your reicpes with amphoteric surfactants?

Crothix is the last thing I need! It's way too thick. . . . the two-in-one has set solid! If it were any more solid I would be getting on for a shampoo bar.
I have plenty of polymer (Carbopol 940) that I could use if I wanted to thicken. What is Crothix?
Anyway, I will have to reduce the surfactants from 20% to 15% and try again. Also I think the pearliser was too much at 2%, perhaps 0.2% would be more like it.

Crothix is a proprietary thickener made by Croda. I don't think it would work in this case.

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Irena
Closed minds are like faulty parachutes; they refuse to open.

Ah, I see. Normally I use polymer to thicken if I need to. I must get some Ultrez-20, it's easier by far than the 940.

The latest batch test (just 200mL) is:

10% ALS
5% AB-30 (amphoteric)
3% glycerin
and roughly 1.3% nonpolars, including the vitamin E, Glossamer, avocado, and cocamide MEA.
So it is about 80% water.

It looks a lot more usable than the last trial. Makes good lather, isn't too thick. I have to wait a few hours now until it stabilises, these mixtures seem to change over time, during the first several hours. At 45C it was quite pourable.

Please post an update in a couple of days if it got any thicker.

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Irena
Closed minds are like faulty parachutes; they refuse to open.

http://www.firp.ula.ve/archivos/materia ... er_154.pdf

This PDF shows how the salt curve works and how it gets modified by certain surfactants. I found it very interesting.

Interesting, thank you.

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Irena
Closed minds are like faulty parachutes; they refuse to open.